Ask Allie!
What is Ask Allie?
Ask Allie is our food-related advice column, where you can ask all your fermenting, cooking, baking, and pantry-related questions to get digestible answers! No question about food is off limits!
Most of you will receive an emailed reply prior to your question hitting the blog, since I frequently think you need a more immediate answer. You should anticipate 1-2 weeks between submitting your question and its appearance on blog. Although emailed replies normally take between 1-3 days, it can take up to a week.
To have your question answered in Ask Allie posts, please use the form on our website. If you prefer to be anonymous, just say so in the form and we’ll leave your name out when we answer it in the blog! Note that some submissions may be edited for clarity.
For troubleshooting active issues with a culture you’re working with, please check the FAQs or write us at support@positivelyprobiotic.com - you’ll get your answer faster that way! Please also take advantage of our Facebook group for troubleshooting, conversation, and getting to know more members of our community!
The first batch of mesophilic yogurt is to be made it’s one- half cup of milk as stated in instructions, and you state further that the first few batches may not be good. Am I too assume that exact test batch has 1/2 cup of milk? Then if good one can make A quart?
— Linda
You could, Linda, but we still advise that the first 3 batches be small so as to help strengthen the culture while it’s getting back into the swing of things! If you want to bump the next 2 up to a cup, I think that’s fine, but I personally would hold off on a full quart until the 4th batch. If you choose to still do it, save an extra sample in the freezer in case something goes wrong.
I have ordered your coconut sourdough starter but I’m new at this and would like to know if the results will be identical to starters using wheat flour. There are a lot of recipes on sourdough wheat starters but nothing I could find on coconut sourdough starters. Will the starter rise as well as the wheat ? I understand coconut absorbs more water than other flours so what would be good proportions. Will I get instructions on the starter package when it arrives? Thanks so much for your help! I have tried other starter without success so I would like this one to work.
— Jean
You will not get identical results, no. It’s not possible to get the same effect as wheat without wheat, though many people do come close with various gluten-free options. Ditto the rise on the starter. The instructions for activating are on the website, though. We don’t print them for y’all so we can do are part in reducing waste! I would assume that you should use 5x the weight of the flour you’re adding in water, because that’s about the right target for coconut’s absorptive properties. What I would do is Google for coconut flour bread recipes. I haven’t started developing recipes for our coconut yet, because I’m still trying to get some stuff worked out with the oat (this is going poorly for me, so as of this column I’ve set it aside and will be starting coconut soon). Coconut is next on my list, but my guess is that I will not try to make breads from it that are meant to replicate wheat breads, and will instead develop recipes that celebrate the coconut for what it is. It’s possible I’ll get a wild hair and try to do something wheat-like, but what I’ve learned about gluten-free baking since I started working for PP is that there really is no replacement for gluten, and so the goal really should be deliciousness without lamenting that it’s not wheat.
Hi, I recently ordered and received a starter packet of your bulgarian yogurt. I got tired of too many unpredictable and untraceable failures from trying to use store-bought yogurt as a starter, found continuous investment in short lived commercial starters offensive to my (sometimes) frugal nature, and am excited about the potential for a life-long relationship with this one. And I have some questions!
First, does the fat content of milk have any effect on the health of the starter over time? I tend to prefer a lower fat yogurt, and don't mind if the consistency is thinner. I am curious if there are other effects I haven't observed.
Second, i have often used the UHT organic, could this cause any problem with the health of my culture? (I haven't yet found organic/pasture farmed milks that AREN'T UHT.)
Thirdly, what is the reason(s) for emphasizing that the milk should be heated SLOWLY to 180 degrees? What happens if i heat it more quickly? And how slow do you mean? 10, 20, 30 minutes or longer? (I am not sure the lowest setting on my stove is sufficient to get the temperature high enough, especially with a large batch.) Also, is there any issue with cooling the milk quickly (in an ice water bath)? In addition, do you have any comments on the methodology that brings milk up to a boil? My first batch did end up boiling because the 1 cup is such a small amount and i didn't realize my thermometer wasn't deep enough to give me a good reading.
Fourthly, have finished my second culturing of the bulgarian variety i received from Positively Probiotic. The first batch (of one cup milk that steamed away to something like 7 oz) did not seem to be setting AT ALL after 7+ hours. I then observed that it looked like maybe the culture had settled to the bottom (a fresh starter sure doesn't seem like it wants to blend easily) so i stirred it up a bit (though i have read some instructions that specify not to jostle your unfinished yogurt). The next time i checked it it had set up beautifully so i figured maybe i did the right thing. My next batch (3 cups) set up in the 5 hour time frame. HOWEVER, and here's the heart of the issue i took a long time to get to- neither batch has very much tartness. They have a lovely thick texture i've never seen (probably because for once i used an ordinary pasteurized full fat milk). The first batch i can't eat, it is too insipid. The second has a slight tang at the finish but still isn't the flavor i'm looking for. Do i simply need to be patient for a couple more batches, or should I leave the culture incubating for a longer time as a general practice? It is hard for me to tell before setting it out to cool because the idea of tasting or eating warm yogurt is repulsive to me (no judgement on those who like it).
In case it is significant, i've been using the two quart yogourmet multi incubator with a glass container. I also have a 2 quart vintage yogourmet (not multi) machine.
Finally, as you may be able to tell, i am very interested in all the little details of yogurt making. I have yet to find a good, in depth discussion of the nuances of the art. What i've learned is piecemeal from different recipes and a tidbit at a time from various online sources. (And everybody has their own way, but there's only a very basic exploration of the WHY and what the results of the specifics are.) If you know of any source where i might get a reliable scientific type of deep exploration of the topic i would be grateful if you'd point me in the right direction. I'm also interested in your own expertise on the subject, and i tried paging through the back issues of your blog to find it, but got discouraged (maybe too soon) because so much of it was about things other than yogurt.
Thanks in advance for any time and energy you spend addressing my questions! Some things i suppose i will learn for myself, and I am not opposed to this process, but I always like to benefit from the experience of others.
— Shyla
I too am frugal, so I feel you on this!
Yogurts prefer whole fat, but that doesn’t mean you have to make them with whole fat milk. There was a period where I made my kid’s yogurt with 1% or 2%, and although it was a bit looser (less thick), it was still fine. When I wanted it thicker, I just strained it for an hour or two on the counter.
To the best of my knowledge, all organic milks that are sold in grocery stores tend to be UHT, but that also should ferment fine. If anything, it gives you a leg-up because you only have to heat the milk to around 90-110 instead of the rest of the heating and cooling business. I also often will boil my milk until it’s caramelized, so although the milk isn’t being heated to the same temp as UHT, it boils like that in my crockpot for an hour or two (so does basically the same job while producing a sweeter, more candy-like yogurt). When I’ve used shelf-stable milk (always UHT), also no problems. So you should be good on this front.
That said, sometimes the first 1-2 batches of a new yogurt will be runny, not set right, or otherwise be weird. Just use that to reculture, as it should be fine by the third batch. It also can take a few batches to hit the tanginess you’re looking for, but these short fermentation times will make it take longer to hit its tang stride. In general, the longer a ferment, the more tart the product. I sometimes will let me thermophils go up to three days fermenting, if SERIOUS tang is what I’m looking for from that batch! I’d give it at least 12 hours, but maybe even 24. All of that said, I do not own or use a yogurt making machine, so your mileage may vary on what times work best for you. Mostly I use either a cooler with lots of blankets in it or the InstantPot Sabrina sent me (without the gasket, and at the lowest setting).
Milk should be slowly heated and cooled to prevent textural problems. Quickly heated or cooled milk can result in grainy or other strange textures. That said, I still totally do it sometimes (I also sometimes heat my milk in the microwave), but I do it knowing there’s a chance that will happen and that the yogurt will be used for smoothies or other things that hide that fact. If you have one of those little dipper crockpots, that’s perfect for these activation batches. Otherwise, I’d do it with a double boiler.
You’re right, though. The blog has a much stronger focus on bread, and especially during the period where America is trying to learn how to bake at the same time. I have been working on diversifying that again, so there are recipes on the blog for labneh (yogurt cheese; basically the same as cream cheese), tuna casserole, ice cream. In most instances, if I put out a recipe based on yogurt, it doesn’t need to be the yogurt I was using for it (there’s a colcannon up there with viili, a Jason’s Deli fruit dip copycat recipe, and a Greek yogurt muffin recipe, for example). There are also TONS of resources on the science of yogurt that you could peruse, but they’re all really too numerous to link. I would Google “science of yogurt,” and you’ll be surprised by what comes up!
When I start to make sour cream and cover the container, should I close the lid tightly? I’m using a mason jar.
— Jim
I always do, Jim. I run a lot of different cultures, so I don’t want cross contamination. In terms of what it needs, the yogurt doesn’t care if it’s a tight or loose lid. Also, lids help prevent gnats.
Can i make langfil yogurt in my instapot?
— George
No, it’s a mesophil, so it wants room temperature.
Which yoghurt culture has the greatest variety of bacteria and yeast?
— Douglas
Amasi. At its strongest, it can contain up to 13 different strains. If you want more than that, go milk kefir (30-50, on average).
Allie, Room Temperature for me is 65-68 degrees in the winter. Is that OK for Mesophillic cultures? Note, my fridge is new and does not have a hot top. I could use a seed starting mat? Any other suggestions?
— Leigh
It should be fine, though you can use a seed mat if you’d like to. The mesophils will still ferment at colder temperatures, but they take a lot longer.
I recently bought some sourdough bacteria through Amazon. I have an issue, though. Every time I feed the starter, it will double in size. However, it quickly collapses. How am I supposed to make brerad if the starter keeps collapsing?
— A few of you
They always collapse. You can still bake with them once they have.
I've just added water & flour to my starter to feed it. How long do I wait to use it in the recipe - a couple hrs, a day or till it's doubled in size? and if I'm putting some of it back into the fridge, can I do that after just an hour? Also, I think I read that one can store the finished dough in the fridge before baking it, or let it rise in the fridge (taking more time of course) - is that correct?
I just received it from you about 3 wks ago, feeding according to your schedule for the first week & then once/twice wk thereafter. So it was last fed a little less than a week ago. When I took it out of the fridge (before feeding) there was about 144g and I’ve fed it all in order to make extra dough. The whole thing can go in the fridge after an hour, or just what I’m not going to use? And then when it’s doubled in size, it’s ready?
— Cindy
It should be fine for baking now. Warm it up a few hours before baking (just leave it on counter), and no – doubled in size isn’t going to be helpful here, because without a room temp feeding, it’s hard to tell when the doubling is complete, when it’s falling, etc. Just go on ahead and feed it once you take it out and then bake a few hours later. That’s going to be simplest. Some people do bake with cold starters, but breads may not rise as well.
